- The aim initially was to make a national impact in STEM by utilizing our 150 university consortium. So, initially, OSA was established as an additional avenue for advancing our research and development work with our core university partners within that consortium, 'cause we know a lot of research is being conducted in the university setting. So as we delve deeper into OSA's potential, we recognize the opportunity to leverage ORAU's 75 years of experience.

- [Announcer] You're Listening to "Further Together: the ORAU Podcast." Join Michael Holtz and his guests for conversations about all things ORAU. They'll talk about ORAU storied history, our impact on an ever-changing world, our innovative scientific and technical solutions for our customers, and our commitment to the communities where we do business. Welcome to "Further Together: The ORAU Podcast."

- Welcome to "Further Together: The ORAU Podcast." As ever, I'm your host, Michael Holtz from the Communications and Marketing Department here at ORAU. And I'm chatting with a new friend today, a new face, a relatively new face here at ORAU, Dr. Liv Blackmon, who is the director of the ORAU STEM Accelerator. And today we're gonna talk about what that is, why it's important, and all of the things related to this very new, very important initiative for ORAU. But first, let me bring to the table Dr. Liv Blackmon. Liv, welcome to "Further Together: The ORAU Podcast."

- Thank you so much for hosting me today.

- So glad to have you. So, Liv, you're the director of the ORAU STEM Accelerator, but tell me a little bit about, you know, your background, who you are, and you know, just a little bit about where you came from and what brought you to ORAU.

- Yeah, thanks so much. So I'm absolutely thrilled to be a part of the vibrant ORAU community. As you mentioned, I'm the new director or new-ish director, I've been here almost a year, for ORAU's STEM Accelerator. So I may be referring it to as OSA. That's kind of our name. So my professional journey has been nothing short of exciting as I've dedicated a majority of my career to international capacity building. This has involved collaborating with U.S. federal agencies and international government bodies, really to enhance their capabilities. So my expertise has been pivotal in bolstering the resilience and security of critical infrastructures spanning from energy to water, to transportation to health, to banking and finance. So a lot of the critical infrastructure sectors. My academic path has taken me to George Washington University and George Mason University, where I was an associate professor and associate director for information technology. And then I was the executive director for the Serious Gaming Institute. I delved in the academic setting. I delved into cutting-edge fields like cybersecurity, information technology, and kind of the dynamic convergence of artificial intelligence with innovative technologies as it really relates to education, to training, to workforce capacity, and even working with military agencies and veterans in that space. At the core of my academic journey is my PhD, right? So that centers around... My PhD is actually in sociology, which is oftentimes, you know, puzzling to people because I went from sociology to security and information technology, which typically doesn't happen. But my PhD is centered actually around empowering underrepresented populations in how they go into the STEM world. So my PhD really looked at individuals from like low socioeconomic backgrounds, refugees, immigrants, and a diverse range of people in the U.S. and how can those underrepresented minorities go into STEM fields. So that's actually part of my dissertation was really focused on looking at how innovative education technology can be useful to transform underrepresented communities. So as you can tell in my career, I'm really passionate about shaping education, training, and workforce strategies that uplift communities either in the U.S. or internationally. And really just ensuring the success in STEM fields. And, you know, it's just an honor to bring that kind of unique perspective and experience to the ORAU community.

- And it feels like everything in your background has led to you right this moment of launching the ORAU STEM Accelerator.  So Liv, tell me, you know, kind of in a nutshell what the ORAU STEM Accelerator is.

- Yeah, absolutely. So the STEM accelerator is really our vision is to be the nation's leading catalyst for advancing STEM education through transformative and innovative approaches with the ultimate goal of strengthening our national economy, our global economic and technical leadership. We're very focused on national security, and we're really looking to build a network of public-private partners that will collaborate through research, innovative training and education to transform the U.S. STEM workforce and strengthen America's global leadership in STEM. You know, as I mentioned actually... Sorry. Our areas of emphasis include, you know, workforce strategy, capacity building, education, training and qualifications, pipeline recruitment, placement retention. And, you know, we're really collaborating with ORAU's DEIA office so that we can make sure all of our practices are inclusive to DEIA. So we're collaborating with our offices here. I do think it would be really paramount as we talk about, you know, what is OSA, I think it would be really helpful just to give a couple-minute explanation on like, how did we even come here? How did OSA get envisioned?

- We're looking at solutions for some maybe concerns that we have in the country, right?

- Yeah, absolutely. Yes. And I think that's kind of where our journey began. This is pre me coming to ORAU. So I think it would just be helpful for like a few minutes just to talk a little bit about our journey from the inception of it, from the birth of it, to its current mission. Because we've evolved in the last year. OSA was originally envisioned by the ORAU board in June of 2022, with really a primary goal to enhance and expand our collaboration with the 150 university consortium partners that ORAU has maintained for five, six decades. So the aim initially was to make a national impact in STEM by utilizing our 150 university consortium. So initially, OSA was established as an additional avenue for advancing our research and development work with our core university partners within that consortium 'cause we know a lot of research is being conducted in the university setting. So as we delve deeper into OSA's potential, we recognize the opportunity to leverage ORAU's 75 years of experience in nuclear. So the experience could be directed towards the challenges in STEM education. And we were thinking about how do we expand ORAU because most of ORAU is very targeted within federal agencies. So we were thinking about, how do we expand that outside of federal agencies and how do we address those STEM workforce gaps beyond federal agencies? So can we look at partnering with local state government bodies or industry, academia, nonprofits, research organizations? All of these organizations really grapple with the critical gaps in the areas of STEM workforce. And so we started seeing these gaps and we started talking to these different groups of people, and we realized that through our discussions, a lot of these people struggled with the same things, but they weren't united. They weren't coming together for unification for a greater impact. So they all tackled these challenges with their individual domains. Well, I'm an industry partner, why would I work with academia? Why would I bring in nonprofits or local state? But we saw the power in bringing together the entities to collectively address STEM capacity building. And so this collaborative approach really allowed, you know, it really allowed to jointly build STEM awareness programs, establish talent pipelines, access a wider talent. So one of the primary focuses that I'm gonna talk about in the presentation is really kind of how we're enhancing this holistic ecosystem take and how can ORAU think about forming partnerships with organizations outside of the federal agencies. And I know it's already being done with another division called OGS within ORAU. They're already starting to look or they're starting to work, I believe, with other industry partners. But, you know, our expansion is really looking at how do we have a larger footprint for ORAU in terms of that.

- So Liv, understanding all of that, I mean, it's a huge undertaking, right? So what are the mission, vision, and goals of the ORAU STEM Accelerator?

- Yeah, absolutely. Great question. So, our vision is very focused on leading the development of a sustainable, diverse, and innovative global STEM environment that really drives U.S. competitiveness and fosters equitable access to educational opportunities in STEM. Our mission. So our mission includes fostering cross-sector partnerships, as I mentioned before. We know that organizations are operating in these silos and we're really working to bring together those silos to build this holistic approach. We are promoting evidence-based research and innovative solutions, and providing training and resources to equip the next generation of STEM workers to meet these future demands. So based on what we believe needs to happen, we set four pretty deep strategic goals, which you'll see all kind of interconnect and support our drive to improve this like STEM ecosystem. So first we are mobilizing public-private partners, and that's key to building the right ecosystem. And this is gonna bolster, you'll see, goals two, three, and four. So goal two, and one of our really primary focus areas, is designing collaborative research and development with our partners. So through our work, we hope to better understand how effective current STEM learning environments work and where can they be improved to address those needs, again, with those like public-private partners. Third, from those research and development outcomes, so, you know, here we have the public-private partnerships, then we have the research and development, and then we take that research and development and we are focused on really gaining a deeper understanding of potential solutions. So research and development we often refer to as like discovery, and then discovery into solutions. So how do we take that discovery and support an integrated, customized and innovative STEM education? And then finally the fourth one, so you'll see like, right, it's kind of like a cyclical approach. Finally, you know, we find ways to inform and transform these solutions at the local, state and national level. So it's kind of a complete package. And so our goals at OSA are centered around actually three sector areas. So, number one, and the biggest priority for OSA for fiscal year 24 and forward. So our biggest priority is nuclear science and technology. Now that's very broad, right? Nuclear S and T is everything from energy to weapons. What we're really focused on is we're putting our primary focus, and I'm gonna dive deeper into this later on in the podcast, is really focused on nuclear energy. And so our vision, you know, doesn't stop there. You know, we are hoping to use that piloted program in fiscal year 24 to grow into critical infrastructure around global water security and space manufacturing. So the road ahead is really filled with promise and innovation in the nuclear energy sector. And I can't wait to share what we're doing at OSA later on in the podcast.

- Awesome, awesome, awesome. Yeah, there's definitely a lot going on. And I know you and others have been working hard to bring this about. If I could, and I know we've touched on this a little bit, why is this important now? Why is it important that we're doing this right now?

- Yeah, great question. You know, there's an urgent need for STEM talent. So we're launching a STEM accelerator because it's high time we really address a pressing concern. We know the United States is falling behind its international competitors when it comes to STEM talent and skills. The shortfall has left us with a critical shortage of qualified workers to fill essential positions. We know that's happening in nuclear energy. Recently, we've had to hire, I think, something like 2000 Taiwanese for a nuclear power plant facility because we don't have our own internal workforce. So it's very urgent. So the root of the issue, so why is this happening? I think it's probably a multifaceted problem. I believe that our training and education programs have to evolve and keep pace with the ever-changing demands of what we're needing of the modern job market. And we need to equip students and workers with the skills required to meet those demands. So this kind of means rethinking our approach to education and training in critical STEM areas, nuclear being one. We need to really shift towards a more flexible and inclusive approach, breaking down the silos that often separate different sectors and regions, and really fostering that cross-functional, cross-disciplinary method so we can avoid fragmented efforts and inefficiencies. Education and training programs need to become more responsive to the needs of employers and workers. And it's about aligning our efforts with the ever evolving job market. So, you know, we're launching OSA to be a catalyst for this kind of positive change. Our primary initial focus, again, is in the nuclear sector. And we're setting the stage for that kind of new approaches to, which I'll talk about, to STEM education. And OSA's really dedicated to creating a centralized hub for nuclear energy and bringing together employers and educators and policy makers with our partners, not just for industry, but... Sorry, local and state governments for nonprofits. And so, in essence, we believe OSA is one of the answers to the growing demands for education. And we're looking at this from a forward-looking initiative aimed at overcoming the challenges that have held us back in driving this future in the United States.

- So, Liv, you've talked about, you know, this critical need really kind of across the board. Obviously, you know, there are a lot of issues, but why is it particularly important and why are we focused to start with on nuclear energy?

- That's a great question. So before we dive deeper into our conversation, let's kind of set the stage. Our nation really finds itself at a critical juncture in the realm of clean energy, striving for an ambitious goal of becoming carbon neutral. So our nature... So we know that America is moving towards this clean energy future, and we need that energy to not only be clean, but reliable and cost effective. So nuclear facilities can cleanly power small towns, big cities, and everywhere in between. Nuclear means we can create a clean energy future faster and more affordably than with renewables alone. So nuclear provides kind of that clean, reliable, secure energy we can count on in the energy future. It's constantly reliable, 24/7, 365, rain or shine, hurricanes. Nuclear power is the kind of clean energy of the future. It does so no matter what's outside. And so it's also very cost effective. So our nation needs to be able to, you know, independently produce its own energy. Next generation nuclear facilities are smaller, simpler to construct, and more affordable than ever. So nuclear increases our energy independencies by providing the steady, secure supply here at home. Okay. So that sets the stage, right?

- Sorry. Let me just step in and just say, so we know that nuclear energy is undergoing this sort of renaissance, right? As you've mentioned, it's more cost effective, it's more affordable. Facilities are smaller. They're quote unquote affordable. You know, all of those sorts of things that we're talking about. And we need to be ready for that. We need to be ready and we need people who are capable of being part of that industry, and that's really kind of where OSA comes in.

- You're spot on. So nuclear power is not only a source of new investments and cost-effective clean energy, but it's also a vital contributor to maintaining affordable electricity. And guess what, high-quality jobs. Yet the U.S. nuclear energy industry faces significant challenges in attracting and retaining a qualified workforce. You know, retirements, retention issues, inflation, shifting demographics, I mean, I can go on. This is all documented from NEI, Nuclear Energy Institute, and projections are suggesting worsening labor market conditions over the next decade extending into 2060. So highlighting the urgent need to address these workforce challenges are huge. I don't know if you're familiar with this, but recent legislation initiatives such as the Inflation Reflection Act represent significant federal investments all geared towards propelling the United States towards a decarbonization goal. So a substantial portion of this funding is dedicated to strengthening, guess what, nuclear energy and our to clean energy. So NEI came out with a report that more than 90% of our existing nuclear power plants are extending their operating license to 80 years, an imminent deployment of advanced reactors. So the industry faces an immediate need to ensure a steady supply of diverse and highly qualified workers. You know, as I was mentioning in the realm of advanced reactors alone, the DOE foresees a need for 236,000 skilled professionals to oversee manufacturing, construction, operation. And those projections are revealing a challenging U.S. labor market all over the next decade and into 2060. So again, this necessitates not just OSA, but the community to proactively approach how are we going to meet these critical workforce challenges, right? The industry's already struggling. Federal government's putting in more money. We can't retain qualified personnel. And yet we're gonna be in this kind of mission to create this nuclear ecosystem and we don't have really a strategy around that. And so from what we're hearing in terms of these kind of critical nature of the nuclear energy sector and needing this highly skilled and diverse workforce, OSA is creating two different kind of avenues. Our first one is really creating a holistic nuclear ecosystem. So we believe that we can help drive change by uniting the nuclear ecosystem to craft a comprehensive strategies that spans across various sectors. So our approach, and we are gonna, in 2024, we will be creating this nuclear ecosystem with industry, government agencies, national labs, FFRDCs, academia. This will help bridge the gaps that have held us back to create kind of this ecosystem to figure out they're all having these same issues. Like, how can we come together holistically to figure out what is the strategy, what is the implementation? How do we build this? So that's one. And number two is creating an academic alliance for a sustainable future. So we're forging a dynamic academic alliance that extends from K-12 to community colleges and technical schools to four-year institutions that are actually particularly situated around power plants. But it's not just about location. It's also about preparing the workforce of tomorrow. So bringing these communities together, again, like K-12 all the way through, we're not only fostering career awareness, starting in K-12, but also building pipelines, offering , enhancing recruitment strategies, and most importantly, ensuring that DEIA cuts across that to help champion how we can champion best practices in DEIA.

- Awesome. Are there specific examples of what we're doing in those sort of career awareness pipeline training and education that you can talk about? Or is that still under development?

- Yeah, absolutely. So I talked a little bit about this nuclear committee, which is really a national effort. We're also working separately with Nuclear Energy Institute, NEI, American Nuclear Society, ANS, and Institute of Nuclear Power Operators, INPO. And I'm just gonna highlight a few things that we're doing. So with NEI in fiscal year 24, we're working in four separate work streams with their working groups. So NEI is the lead and we're collaborating with them. So all of these four things I'm gonna talk about is really an ecosystem that NEI developed for industry. So we're creating a really strong partnership with them to, number one, support them on this nuclear energy workforce career center. We're gonna partner with them to build this career center that will be online that supports everything from soup to nuts in terms of building the workforce for industry. So our role is really gonna be focused on academia and building kind of like utilizing our nuclear academic alliance that we're building. So that's number one. Number two is career awareness. So OSA will be, again, collaborating with NEI and other industry partners to conduct webinars and meetings with nuclear educators and labor groups, really to gain their insights and career awareness tactics and create a repository of, what are the best career awareness tactics that we can be utilizing and sharing that information? We are also gonna be working with them to create a publicly accessible website to better highlight career opportunities. We're not quite sure yet what that's gonna look like 'cause we're still adapting it and trying to figure out like what are the needs that, you know, including like a modern approach to career pathways. So that's number two. Number three, we're doing work around pipelines. So you can see, right, how this is kind of building career awareness then pipelines. We're identifying opportunities and best practices for improving and expanding partnerships with universities and colleges to attract workers to the nuclear industry. So kind of the areas that we are gonna be taking action on are, again, having workshops and webinars to look at a variety of different critical areas and pipelines, which can include, I mean, I'm gonna say some of them, there's probably more that we'll be doing 'cause this is one of our things in 24, but financial support for key university and college programs. And that's like, you know, how can industry fund students and things like that to go to college? Curriculum development. How do we have standardization? How do we share curriculum? How do we innovate curriculum? How do we use new AI tools for efficiency? Internships, scholarships and grants, pipeline tactics, yada yada. You know.

- All the things .

- And then our final fourth one that we're doing with NEI is training and qualifications. So really excited to actually announce this. We found out yesterday that we'll be coming out with a co-authored white paper to all the chief nuclear officers in industry focused on advocacy for innovative training using approaches like AI to make training more efficient at nuclear power plants. And that white paper will go to industry CNOs. And that's one of the things that we'll be doing. We'll also be facilitating alignment between nuclear energy and tech and two-year and four-year schools. Like how does industry play into education and training? We are also supporting, so the nuclear power operators to modernize training materials. And so one of the things that we're doing with the nuclear power operators is how can we build curriculum programs to focus on community college training and curriculum development? And we're working with INPO and nuclear training and the National Uniform Curriculum program on that. So you can see, like we have quite a lot of national efforts that OSA's already plugged into. And from a local regional perspective, we recently partnered with Oak Ridge National Labs and UT Knoxville on an EDAE proposal to build the Tennessee nuclear power industry in Tennessee. So that's one of the regional. We're also looking for ways to support the Tennessee governor Bill Lee's initiative with the $50 million program to support the expansion of nuclear in the state of Tennessee. And how do we collaborate and help and support that as it focuses on workforce and education and training, which is gonna be probably a primary area. But we're not quite clear yet on what role we would have in that. But we do wanna support that kind of initiative at the local regional levels.

- We know we have this growing industry that is at this inflection point. We are doing a lot to basically help fill that pipeline, fill the qualifications and change the education and all of these things. Where do we go from here?

- Yeah. So, you know, I think that, so for now, for fiscal year 24, we're gonna focus on nuclear energy in those domains. Career awareness, pipeline training, certification, DEIA, and this is gonna benefit the nation. We will leverage our 150 universities. We're gonna build this network to support the nuclear industry. We're gonna create this kind of leadership model, academic alliance, and then that's really national. So we're trying to ground into the national ecosystem while also supporting the local and regional. So national strategies are one thing, and it's another thing to take those national strategies because every local and regional area, power plants and et cetera, have their own unique challenges. And so if you create a national strategy and an implementation plan, it may not affect or impact or have the same problems at the local regional. So we're also looking at supporting local regional and economic impact of nuclear energy, and focus on, how do we help those areas with economic analysis, cluster strategy modeling, things like that, diagnostics, workforce mapping, and helping them with their own local regional strategies for the energy industry? So that's kind of like what we're doing from the national, local, regional perspective.

- Liv, I know we've covered a lot in the nuclear energy sector. Is there anything we haven't covered that you wanna make sure we talk about?

- As I mentioned, our primary focus is nuclear energy for OSA. But let's shift gears just for a second because we are using our model of public-private partnerships in two other areas. So first, we are collaborating with Vanderbilt, UGA and SUNO. Recently we were awarded a National Science Foundation Crisis Planning grant on climate and on water security. So we use that nuclear model that I talked about to build the private, public... Sorry. We use the nuclear model to build the public-private partnership. And we received this planning grant to look at how can we open a national center for water security, and what does water security mean? So I don't think everybody realizes that across the United States, not everybody has clean drinking water, has access to clean drinking water.

- It's really important.

- It's so important. And, you know, Michael, like sometimes people are like, "What? In the United States? Are you sure it's not in this other country that may be a little bit more disadvantaged than the United States?" Yes, in the United States, we have water scarcity. We have aging infrastructure. We have water quality problems. Flooding. Climate change. And so we visioned a public-private partnership across the southeast that looks at research and development challenges and can inform local, regional, state, national solutions. So back to the discovery to solutions. Research development to how do we take that to create solutions and create environmental justice and equity to address these historical and contemporary disparities with the goal of ensuring that all communities have equitable access to safe and affordable water, and equitable consideration to management and mitigation. And so over the next year, we are partnered again with Vanderbilt, UGA and SUNO to establish a full national center for water security.

- That's amazing!

- Yeah. I feel like it really just gives back to the community and it supports. I mean, water is our primary source for our body.

- A really important issue. Yeah.

- Yeah. So that's number one. Number two is, again, we're using the same public-private partnership model to get a National Science Foundation, this is a long word Industry University Cooperation Research Center, aka IUCRC, in Florida, on space manufacturing. So OSA is really collaborating with a lot of universities in Florida, and we're helping to mobilize over 36 industry partners to come together. A huge diverse network to enhance research and development in the sector of space manufacturing. So those are our kind of two other areas that we're working in that we're leveraging that public-private partnership ecosystem, like holistic approach to solving really pretty significantly large challenges in this environment. In both of those areas, our primary role is looking at the education, training and workforce. So water security education, training and workforce. Space manufacturing, education, training, and workforce. So again, we have that kind of common theme going across all of our programming,

- All of the sectors. Yeah. If someone's listening to this conversation and they're drawn to the possibility of joining in this effort, they wanna partner, whether they're government, whether they're industry, nonprofit, academic, how can people get in touch with you to learn more, to learn about what's possible, et cetera?

- Yeah. So a few things. So first, you know, if people are listening and they think, "Oh, this seems interesting, how do I fit in?" Like I'm a government agency, how would a government agency work with OSA? Or how would an industry partner work with OSA? A few things. First, our role, as I've mentioned, is mobilizing a network of public-private partners really to create kind of outside-the-box thinking with new strategies and actionable implementation plans that could help build your sector. We do things from like hosting design thinking workshops to helping write strategy and implementation plans, and things that are actually actionable and tangible. So we are... I would say we are like a do tank. Like there's a think tank where they produce white papers and strategies and all that. We do that and we actually do the work. Also another thing is we're really looking for partners to collaborate, to garner new grants and contracts and go after new opportunities to build local, regional, and national education, training and workforce. So that's of interest. But ultimately, if somebody's interested, I would check out our website. Under Partners, you can see all the different partner types and ideas for each partner, ideas on ways that you could collaborate with us. So that's probably the first thing. So website. And then the second thing is just send me an email and we can absolutely talk and I can kind of see where their connection is.

- Awesome. So Liv, what's your email address?

- My email is O-L-I-V-I-A, period. Blackmon, B-L-A-C-K-M-O-N, at ORAU.org.

- Awesome. Liv, last question for you. What brings you joy?

- I think, number one, I think there's a few things that bring me joy. My family. My family brings me joy. And everybody thinks of a family as like your spouse and your kids. Not just my spouse and my kids. Like we're Portuguese and Italian and a little bit of Greek, and so we have a huge network of family. I have brother, cousins, parents, grandparent. My 99-year-old grandmother is still alive. And what brings me joy is having that community. So I have a huge community of family and I host them all the time, like weekly for dinners and getting together and talking and having kind of that relationship. So that's my first thing that brings me joy.

- I'm imagining like My Big Fat Greek, Portuguese, Italian Wedding, right?

- That's me. That's number one. Oddly, animals bring me joy. We ride horses, we have pet rats, which are actually delightful little animals. So animals, I think, have this like unconditional loving sense of just unconditional love. And I think they just bring the world joy. Number three is adventuring. My oldest daughter and I, and actually my youngest, we're big adventurers. And when I say adventuring, I'm not talking about just like going to Italy, which we did this summer, but like, how extreme can we adventure? So, you know, I'm talking like hang gliding off of the Dolomites, or-

- Zip lining in the Coliseum .

- Or even sharks, you know, because why not? But we're big adventuring spirits. My spirit is called to adventure. And I think that brings me joy. Being outside brings me joy. Ultimately, so this is all kind of my personal joys. In terms of like work slash personal, 'cause I think it's a little bit of both, what also brings me joy is helping communities. That, I have lived... Well, I have not lived. I've traveled probably to 30 countries around the world, and I have helped everything from local, regional, to national efforts that have impacted individual and communities. Everything from health to water, to education, to training. And watching those communities and what I can help, and being a part of that culture brings me joy. But most importantly is their joy in their environment. So, you know, coming from the United States, we are a privileged society. And I've gone into other societies that may not have the same level of privilege, and yet they are some of the most joyful people. And being mindful of like how they live their daily existence and just the little things that bring them joy, I can take that back to the United States. But I just find joy in those cultures and I find joy in using my skills to help others. I find joy in that as well. My final joy, you can cut whatever you want, is spirituality. I don't know if that's too personal or if we should cut this, but I think finding joy in that kind of spiritual centeredness is really important for me. But that's it!

- Awesome. Liv, thank you for spending this time with me today and talking about the ORAU STEM Accelerator, and also the great things that bring you joy. It has truly been a joy to learn more about the work of the STEM accelerator and really what lies ahead for us and for you with the work that you're doing. So thank you for the time.

- Thank you.

- Thank you for listening to "Further Together: The ORAU Podcast." To learn more about any of the topics discussed by our experts, visit www.orau.org. You can also find us on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn, @ORAU, and on Instagram, @ORAUTogether. If you like "Further Together: The ORAU Podcast," we would appreciate you giving us a review on your favorite podcast platform. Your reviews will help more people find the podcast.