- Having my mentor really invest in me has helped me gain some confidence, going as an early career scientist, that I can do it. And when I don't know what to do, I don't feel too intimidated to ask my mentor, 'cause she's made herself so available and open to me about almost any question. - [Narrator] You're listing to "Further Together," the ORAU podcast. Join Michael Holtz and his guests for conversations about all things ORAU. They'll talk about ORAU's storied history, our impact on an ever-changing world, our innovative scientific and technical solutions for our customers, and our commitment to the communities where we do business. Welcome to "Further Together," the ORAU podcast. - Welcome to "Further Together," the ORAU podcast. The NASA National Postdoctoral Program gives scientists at any level the opportunity to help NASA pursue its mission while also experiencing the world's most diverse technology and expertise. I recently had the opportunity to talk to several NASA NPP Fellows about their research, their personal stories, and what comes next in their careers. This episode features one of those conversations. I hope you'll enjoy it as much as I did. So, Dr. Mandy Lopez, if you would, talk to me about who you are, your current role with the NASA NPP Fellows Program, and just a little bit about your background. - Sure, so, I am a first-year postdoc in the NASA Postdoctoral Program, currently at JPL, the Jet Propulsion Laboratory. I am an Indo-Caribbean geoscientist. I'm originally from South Florida. So, California has been a bit of a change. My research background is broadly in the coastal geoscience world, and I've worked on projects in wetland hydrology, marine renewable energy, marine pollution, and currently, I'm working on studying wildfire impacts at the land-sea interface. - Wow, really interesting topic areas all the way around, really. - Yes. - Have you always, has pursuing a STEM career, has pursuing science always been an interest for you? - It has. - Okay. - I count myself as one of those lucky few who have always kind of known exactly what they wanted to do. - Okay. - From a very young age, I was obsessed with science. It was like "Bill Nye the Science Guy" or bust for me when I was a kid. My parents used to take me to the library so that I could rent the Carl Sagan PBS "Cosmos" show and watch the tapes. And so, it was not a surprise to anyone when I became a scientist and like stuck to this field. It just didn't really feel like anything else was the right fit for me. - Was living in Florida, now being in California, was the area of the country where you lived part of sorta what drew you to coastal studies and aquatic and marine studies? - I think so. You know, Florida's got these gorgeous coastlines, and my bachelor's is in geology and I'm - Okay. - Mostly a geologist. And the classes, the field trips that we would, you know, get to go on, they centered around coastal topics. So, when I had my pick of what to specialize in or what interested me, I just gravitated and once I kinda looked back over the course of my undergrad, my master's, my PhD, I was like, "Oh, I see the trend. It's all coastal work, even though the topics are different." I just, you can't take that Florida girl out of me. - You're a beach bum, but in a different way. - Exactly. - I love it. So, I know you're a first-year, but how has your experience as a NASA NPP Fellow so far impacted your career, impacted your interest and your drive for science? - Yeah, you know, now that you just said that, I'm thinking about it and looking at the date. I just, I'm fresh into my second year now. - Okay. - I've gotten my time mixed up 'cause I've been out on parental leave. So I'm like, "Oh, how long have I been out?" You know, it all kind of melded together. - It all blurs, right? - So I'm technically in the beginning of my second year. - Okay. - But, how has it impacted me so far? It has, even in the short time, already shown me that I can do more than I thought I could do, which was a surprise for me. - Sure. - I'm working on a project now that is tangential to the type of work I've done before, but the methods that I'm using, the finer points of the science are different and especially in the methodologies. These are brand new things to me. So I'm kind of starting from scratch as a newbie on a lot of stuff. And I think that might be a little different from some other postdocs who - Okay. - Kinda continue into what they already know how to do. And so, watching how much I've been able to learn and what I've been able to do in just the first year has kinda shown me like, wow, okay, you can pivot and you can continue to try new things, which was a really cool thing to see. - So science has been really empowering for you in that way? - In that way, yes. Particularly, I would say, the postdoc experience with my mentor, my advisor, my team, that's made a big difference. - Okay. - I think they have all been, the patience and supportive as I've made the mistakes, as I've learned and continue to learn. So I think that's the key link there that helps it all work. - Right, right. So talk a little bit about that. 'Cause I know, you know, you mentioned a mentor. You're also doing very collaborative work. So, and I know those are sort of two separate but connected topics. - Yeah. - Talk about being mentored but also the collaborative process of the science that you're working on. - Sure. Being mentored in the capacity that I am now as a postdoc has been really enriching. It's the first time I've had a mentor really be intentional about time commitment and not just work progress conversations but professional development conversations. And so, knowing that there is a time for me and that my mentors have created space for me to come to them with questions about my actual research, but also anything, you know. I could talk to her about this interview. "Hey, I'm nervous. Can I bounce some answers off of you?" - Sure. - Or, you know, "Here's a poster. Do you mind taking a glance?" Just having that person really make the space and time to look at it and to have honest conversations, you know, not afraid to give you real feedback, where it may not always be like the best thing you wanted to hear, but you needed to hear. Like oh, okay, yeah, I could do better at this thing or it made the poster better with your edits. You know, that kind of thing. - Sure. - So having my mentor really invest in me has helped me gain some confidence, going as an early career scientist, that I can do it. - Mm hmm. - And when I don't know what to do, I don't feel too intimidated to ask my mentor, - Okay. - 'Cause she's made herself so available and open to me about almost any question, even sometimes the silly ones, which sometimes navigating NASA can be a bit bureaucratic. And having someone on the inside to ask questions to helps. - Can be helpful, absolutely. - Yeah. So, that is my mentor's best little speech. Where collaborative side of things, I guess I can also give my mentor amazing points for that. Because, - #bestmentorever. - Hashtag, yeah, best mentor ever. - She does a great job of saying, "Okay, you're interested in these research topics and areas. Let me put you in contact with other people who are working in these areas." And that's actually how I've fallen into many of the collaborations that I'm in right now - Cool. - With my research, you know? She's been the one to make those initial introductions and say, "Hey, I think the two of you have similar interests. Have a chat about it." And that's been able to build the bridges or at least have starting points to build bridges with the collaborators. And then, from there, so far, in this postdoc, the collaborative process has been wonderful in that the communication between team members is really high-quality. I think, - Awesome. - In the past, you know, projects where you don't have team members that communicate well, it gets clunky, deadlines are missed, feelings are triggered. - Sure. - But where you have teams that really communicate well, they function well, you know, things get done in a timely and organized way, it just, it all functions better and the science that comes out at the end of it is that much better for it. - That's great. Have you, so you talked about being mentored, you talked about collaboration, have you had the opportunity to mentor others at this stage in your career and what has that been like? - Yes, so, I have. I was able to mentor two undergraduate students while I was a PhD student. They were both completing different research projects, and now, as a postdoc, I am a mentor to a group of three interns - Okay. - That are, I think, scattered between undergrad and graduate students on one of the projects that I work on. And in most of these cases, it's been really great to pass on what I am getting from my mentor and try to implement that same openness, the communication, the availability of time for them. You know, setting aside weekly time commitments where they know they have a time and a space to come to me, being intentional about not just the work stuff that we need to get done for project reasons, but initiating career conversations. You know, "Do you like what you do? What about it do you like or don't you like? Let's help you navigate what your next steps might be." Because I think, at this undergraduate, maybe even earlier graduate stage, there's still an uncertainty about which way you wanna go and whether you wanna continue on with research or maybe join the workforce. All of that can be really daunting, especially if you don't know what it's like. - Right. - And I have had the benefit of being both in academia, but I've also taken time in between my degrees to be in the work world and do other things. So, I really try to, you know, have the mentees that I talk to benefit from the world experience that I have and hope that it helps them make their choices without maybe taking as long as I did to make mine. - That's okay, though, right? 'Cause you know you're on the right path. - Yes, yes, I mean, even though my path was a little bit windy and twisty turvy, yeah, it all worked out. I'm happy that it happened the way it did. - Right, well, so, along those lines, what advice would you give to an up-and-coming scientist who might be following in your footsteps? - Yeah. That's a big one. I want, you know, there are a couple of different places my mind goes with that one. I think a big takeaway that I've had over the long time it took me to find the right programs, projects, and jobs for me was finding work environments that were the right fit for me. - Okay. - There are places that maybe have a bit more prestige or the project that you really love, but maybe the team that you would work with wouldn't be able to support you as much as you need them to, be that in time or in mentoring or whatever. And kind of thinking about what it, you know, how you work best and trying to find a work environment where you will be well-suited to it. I think that I started and participated in projects where I was really interested in one aspect of that equation, but the other aspect wasn't quite there. And it wasn't a fun time. - Mm hmm. - And there is no perfect job, so there are gonna be days where you're frustrated or really let down about something. And it's easy in those times, if you're not in a place that's a good fit, to think about maybe quitting and maybe science isn't for me. But I would push back and say, science is for everyone. There is a place for you, I promise, but it's kind of tricky navigating, you know, like finding a place where, if you know you need a mentor that you can talk to regularly, look for that, make that a priority when you ask questions about, you know, starting a degree program or a job. You know, try to get a feel for what that work environment is like. And then the other piece of advice is to persevere. Even if you find the best fit, like I said, there will be bad days - Right. - Where things do not go your way. And hang in there, you know? Keep going. It is worth it, I believe, in the end, and if it's what you really do want to do and you're in a good healthy space, persevere. Don't give up. - Great advice, really great advice. Why would you recommend the NASA NPP Fellowship to others? - I would say that the NPP is unique, with the asterisk of, this is the only postdoc I've done, so, not speaking of what the other ones are like, but, this one, in my experience, has allowed me to try new things and jump onto projects that are different, out of my wheelhouse, just completely opened me up to possibilities that I don't think happen in other post, traditional postdocs. The way that the NPP is structured with its funding and its oversight and how, you know, you're mentored or advised, it really lends itself to you diversifying - Okay. - If you want to. You don't have to. And there's a lotta flexibility in that that I find refreshing. Because after you spend, let's say, four or five years in a PhD, you've done one thing and it's nice to try something new - Sure. - And not feel like you're derailing your whole career to try that new thing. If you always had a question that or a research topic or area that you kinda thought was cool, this is a great space to try it out with. It's only a few years, but it's still enough time to really dabble and see if that's another avenue to pursue for you or not. And by that token, there's also the internal funding at most NASA centers, the way it works, so that while you're there, you're, I've been encouraged to think of new research ideas and concepts and to go for it, to apply for those funds, and see what happens. - Right. - It just feels like the world of possibilities open. And for a scientist, I find that so exciting that I can just think of ideas and kind of pursue them. - That is really cool. So, it sounds like - Yeah. - You have found a great place in the NASA NPP Fellowship Program to do that. Mandy, for you, last question. - What brings you joy? - Sure. Oh. That is a big life question. Well, there, I would say, there is joy in categories for me. Maybe I just have a very type A brain and this is how I'm thinking about it. But in the professional sense, being in a work environment that I feel respected and supported in has brought me joy. It hasn't necessarily been the actual research every day or the affiliation to whatever organization I'm at. It's usually been a good environment with people that are easy to work with, bring a smile to your face, like, in the work sense, - Okay. - That creates a lot of joy. Because then the passion for science that I have is nurtured and it doesn't feel like I'm working. - Right. - But, aside from the work category, in the general life category, probably, my family, which I think might be a cliched answer. But I'm incredibly blessed with a wonderful spouse, cat, and a brand new baby, so, I'm feeling like pretty lucky, pretty exhausted, but pretty lucky. - Sure. Well, you did day you just got back from parental leave, so. - I did, yes, oh man, I miss not, parental leave is not a cake walk by any means, but I miss not having, you know, time to think about what time of day it is and have to function like like normal humans do. - Totally understood. - Yeah. - Dr. Mandy Mulcan Lopez, thank you so much for joining me today and having this conversation. It was really a joy to talk to you. - Likewise, thanks for having me. - Absolutely. - [Narrator] Thank you for listening to "Further Together," the ORAU podcast. To learn more about any of the topics discussed by our experts, visit www.orau.org. You can also find us on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn @ORAU, and on Instagram @ORAUtogether. If you liked "Further Together," the ORAU podcast, we would appreciate you giving us a review on your favorite podcast platform. Your reviews will help more people find the podcast.